51视频

Today Jesse and Rich interview Karel Tlustak the founder and CEO of an automated advertising tool — ROI Hunter. Diving deep into remarketing for small e-commerce merchants.

Transcript

Jesse: Happy Friday, Richard.

Richard: What鈥檚 happening, Jesse, how are you?

Jesse: I鈥檓 good. I鈥檓 good. It鈥檚 a good day here in San Diego.

Richard: Cleared up for us too.

Jesse: Yeah. We are also out of the polar vortex the rest of the country was dealing with.

Richard: You don鈥檛 miss Minnesota much.

Jesse: No, well, San Diego鈥檚 home. It鈥檚 all good. Today this is interesting, because we are going to be talking about remarketing and so we鈥檙e doing the podcast version of remarketing. We鈥檙e hitting people with the same message over and over. The promo for a lot of our podcasts mentions Facebook remarketing. I think this is real life remarking for a podcast.

Richard: For other people that are parents like us out there. They know you can鈥檛 just say something one time to your kids. And you are our family out there and we want to help you and this is how stuff works. It鈥檚 one of the most effective ways to get more sales, to really get in front of people that have been to your store but didn鈥檛 make a purchase. And so we just want to reiterate as much as we can and we have a guest coming on the show that鈥檚 got to come in as one of the best at it.

Jesse: Absolutely, the idea is that you have to repeat the same message like you train your kids. Lift the seat up, lift the seat up, lift the seat up. Remarketing is the same way, you keep putting that product in front of people and eventually, they鈥檙e going to buy. Today we want to bring on our guests Karel Tlustak. Karel. I think I butchered the last name a little bit. But how are you?

Karel: It was nearly correct.

Jesse: I practiced even but I鈥檒l get there.

Karel: I鈥檝e got some complicated name.

Richard: Another example of needing to do things over and over again.

Jesse: I like it. I like it. Awesome. So, Karel, you鈥檙e calling in from the Czech Republic. If people are wondering what the accent is, that鈥檚 the accent. Karel, give us a little bit of a backstory. Where did you come from? How did you get here?

Karel: Yeah, thanks for having me here. Look, I鈥檓 CEO of ROI Hunter via Facebook and Google partner. And we are managing half a million campaigns, so I could tell you something about remarketing. But really the reason why we鈥檙e here is simply to hunt for better ROI for your clients. That鈥檚 why we are ROI Hunter.

Jesse: Awesome. I noticed your title was Chief Hunter as well. I like that. (laughing)

Karel: Right now I鈥檓 ROI Hunter but I believe in a couple of hours I鈥檓 going to be a Beer Hunter (laughing.) It鈥檚 8 a.m., our pm actually here.

Jesse: It鈥檚 Friday, so I appreciate you sticking around and there鈥檚 no reason you can鈥檛 have a pint in front of you while you鈥檙e podcasting. That鈥檚 the beauty of it.

Karel: I didn鈥檛 have this idea. (laughing)

Richard: It鈥檚 a little early for us too.

Jesse: Awesome. So you鈥檙e the CEO of ROI Hunter but getting back you didn鈥檛 just start doing that. How did you start in the digital marketing world?

Karel: Yeah, I liked to establish the agency business factory 10 years ago and we worked with very small customers here in Europe, many ecom businesses. It was actually me creating first campaigns on Facebook and AdWords for them. But since we had more and more customers now, it鈥檚 nearly two hundred people in our company, and we wanted to grow and via partnering with 51视频. So shining future in front of us.

Jesse: And shining future for all people listening if everybody follows along. So you鈥檇 have the agency, you didn鈥檛 just grow from you and some friends to 200. What was your specialty? Was it your Facebook and Google ads, how did you grow so big?

Karel: Look, it was actually just an agency until one interesting thing happened cuz we had a bunch of developers, I have developer鈥檚 background and recreated a lot of internal tools just to make marketing more efficient and working for our clients. But then we were somehow spotted by Facebook. So they literally gave me a ring and they said: “Hey guys, come to London, show us what you have if you see some interesting activity in our IDI”. So we came and I鈥檇 realized it was some competition that is they called Facebook accelerate program, which was kind of a combination between interesting companies they selected. And they selected us because they liked what we were doing and we worked with their engineers, product guys, commercial teams for half a year. And we鈥檝e done a lot because we were the fastest, we won this program and became the official marketing partner at the end of 2014. So you could say that we are actually a product of Facebook.

Jesse: Awesome. That鈥檚 awesome.

Richard: Not the worst partners to have. (laughing)

Jesse: That鈥檚 awesome. So you guys were building the tools internally and for people that are not in-depth with Facebook ads, there鈥檚 a lot of creative needs. You need to usually get a lot of images, you need a lot of headlines and everybody wants you to test, test, test but it鈥檚 kind of hard to do all that. So I assume your tool was basically helping you do that internally for your own agency.

Karel: Yeah, exactly. But imagine that we were working with a lot of back-end e-commerce companies and they are usually struggling with product feeds and how to make the marketing sufficient and as personalized as possible. We鈥檝e learned a lot, then we鈥檝e realized that we were working with the biggest guys in a region, why don鈥檛 we create a simplified version for small guys? And that鈥檚 why we created ROI Hunter easy. Just using the same engine as the biggest companies are using but for very small customers that are starting with marketing.

Jesse: Oh, that鈥檚 perfect. I like that story because I think that鈥檚 a lot of what 51视频 is. It鈥檚 taking enterprise technology and then packaging it and making it easy for smaller companies to do it. So maybe that鈥檚 why we are working together on this podcast, we both have the same goal there. That鈥檚 awesome. Yeah, so the tool was basically鈥� So ROI Hunter and by the way up for full disclosure, I use the tool as well at 51视频 managing our advertising as well. I think it鈥檚 pretty cool. Let鈥檚 see, how can we describe this for a user? Basically, you connect to a product catalog for people and then鈥� Can you describe some of the magic that happens behind the scenes?

Karel: I think that the magic starts with the data we have as we鈥檙e managing half million campaigns. You know what works for what type of customer. We simply look at your website, take the product catalogs that you have, and create structures of campaigns on Facebook and Google so that you are covered and just set up the budget and make sure you got maximum for your budget.

Jesse: Got it. So unlike an agency, people have Delton agency as you usually talk to a person, you say “Make my numbers better and here are some ideas on what we could do”. You essentially have a tool that does that automatically.

Karel: Yes, that鈥檚 correct. You have the dashboard, you set up the budget, and you see performance life and the whole magic is happening on a back-end.

Richard: One again, just in case someone hasn鈥檛 listened to any of the other episodes. This is specifically dealing with the feeds that you have in your store. So as long as you have your prices and your pictures and your descriptions up, no additional things you need to do other than set the budget and watch how the campaign鈥檚 going. This isn鈥檛 about creating new creatives, right? This isn鈥檛 like an SEO play.

Karel: Yes, exactly. You take your products and we make sure that people that visited these products see them across the channel on different platforms like Facebook, Instagram, Google, or a website. We make sure that we show the products in the right frequency, not bombard it too much. At the same time you want to be onto their mind, right? As you said you need to repeat it to the children so that they eventually do what you want.

Richard: So without going too deep, cuz if you鈥檝e been doing this for that long and doing a half million campaigns, you can probably completely over, go over, Jesse and I even answered this but with this cross-device, what is that? What does that mean to somebody who doesn鈥檛 quite understand?

Karel: Yeah, I think this is quite a big challenge for most e-commerce marketers because their customers are visiting the website from different devices. It usually starts with mobile, but then they switch to a tablet, maybe desktop at home and you need to get to their attention on all devices ideally. And I believe that Facebook has very good tools for this. People are looking at Facebook on all their devices. And Facebook knows, alright, it has simply all these devices and even though the visitor comes from a cell phone or a website, we can still show your products on their desktops no matter where they are.

Jesse: That鈥檚 a very good important point because especially with the rise of mobile a lot of times people that are looking, search on mobile, but they鈥檙e on the move or they鈥檙e busy and so they look. Purchases don鈥檛 happen on mobile as much as they happen on a desktop because you got to type in all the address and all the credit card information. So that if somebody is looking for your product, they look on mobile and of course, they鈥檙e logged into Facebook and Instagram cuz pretty much everybody is, then when they鈥檙e back home, maybe they鈥檙e at work. They are more in a buying mode because they might be sitting down in a chair and have their wallet and credit card right next to them, then your ad can now be displayed to them. Wherever they go on if you鈥檙e using Facebook and so it鈥檚 on Facebook, on Instagram. And then if you add Google as well, you鈥檙e on pretty much every site across the internet, so cross-device is super important. And I think for people that are like hearing cross-device and think that鈥檚 hard. It鈥檚 not really that hard at all, those are pixels that pass this information back and forth and maybe a few years ago it would have been difficult to do this cross-device. So that鈥檚 awesome.

Richard: You also mentioned frequency and timing. Right back to our joke early on with the multiple touch points and all that. So do you utilize most of Facebook鈥檚 AI or is it a combination of information that you have with all these campaigns? How do you figure out the right timing and the amount of times to put this feed in front of people?

Karel: Yeah, that鈥檚 a good question because obviously, Facebook has AI, Google has AI as well but they need sufficient data. They can really decide “Okay, I need to do XYZ”. And what we see is that small businesses don鈥檛 have freely big traffic on their website. Their network can鈥檛 work enough. So definitely we鈥檙e using the knowledge that we have from all these customers, half a million campaigns so that we create structure following the best practices we see that are working with other customers. And we try to utilize Facebook and Google AI as much as possible. So that we deliver simply ROI.

Jesse: And the beauty is that you guys are actually combining both of those as well. Right.

Karel: Because I see that it鈥檚 critical to really capture attention as soon as possible cuz you want to have the customer in this whole mood when they鈥檙e thinking “Should I buy it or not?” and then simply if you reached them on all possible spaces, you increase your chance to win them.

Richard: Yeah, cuz someone鈥檚 trying to get in front of them. So you might as well get in front of them again as quickly as possible. It sounds like.

Karel: That鈥檚 pretty important.

Jesse: And did you find I mean, obviously the sooner the better. So if somebody visits this site and abandons the cart or do they just visit the product in and not buy, that鈥檚 what kind of kicks off the process. Is that correct?

Karel: Yeah, correct. And if they visit multiple products, then we try to actually estimate what products are capturing their attention the most, so that they can see even on Facebook where you see like multiple products and you just survive until you can choose for them and Facebook in a carousel format. You see multiple products, you just swipe and choose from them. Facebook is so clever that they are even adding more products that you even didn鈥檛 visit, but they see on that website that these products are interesting for others, for other people that are similar to your profile.

Jesse: I like that. Okay. So if you go visit two products, you might see a carousel ad on Facebook or on Instagram that has five products and basically, Facebook knows because they have seen other people buying on your site.

Karel: Yes, that鈥檚 correct.

Richard: That kind of leads to the next question I have. If you鈥檙e doing the retargeting campaign and then someone eventually buys, is there anything that the merchant needs to do or does it stop that campaign and maybe move on to other products?

Karel: By default, it stops the campaign. If you have a big budget, and we know that we wouldn鈥檛 spend that budget, then obviously we try to reach people similar to your buyers and maybe retarget to people that are similar to those who bought something. And again, this is where Facebook has a lot of information because imagine that for instance, Facebook knows iPhone 9 was bought by people that have iPhone 8 for instance, then it鈥檚 a strong signal that we should actually reach out to people without iPhone 8. We do iPhone 9. So there鈥檚 a lot of AI behind to choose right products to the right people. And that鈥檚 where you are just playing with the budget. Everything鈥檚 happening is magic. You just say, “Hey, okay, I鈥檓 happy with this. I鈥檓 going to increase the budget.”

Jesse: So awesome. I didn鈥檛 realize that. This is even beyond remarketing where remarketing means they had to see the product and then be shown the product again. But you also had the ability to target people that look like those same customers.
Karel: Yeah, it depends just on the budget.
Jesse: Okay. Alright. Awesome.

Karel: Obviously, remarketing has the best ROI, right? So I strongly suggest starting with a smaller budget. Did you capture the best promising customers and then gradually increase it, depending on your result. Jesse: What鈥檚 the minimum that鈥� A lot of people, they haven鈥檛 done advertising before, what鈥檚 the minimum budget that people could start with for remarketing? Karel: But it pretty much depends on the traffic that you have on the website. We actually need enough people to even spend the budgets. So I would stop it $10, $20-50 per day and then you can scale it depending on results, but you need to be patient, you need to wait at least two weeks so that you really see how it develops. And it takes time initially for people to decide. So depending on what you are selling, that might be different. The decision processes and it鈥檚 usually at least a week, so that, even algorithms can learn.

Jesse: Yeah, I think that鈥檚 good advice. A lot of times people get very anxious, but everything takes time. Particularly with this, because it is machine learning and algorithms that are trying to figure out how to, you know until you can find out more people that buy, you have to at least find one or two people that buy. And so it does take time. So that鈥檚, that鈥檚 good advice. What else should merchants know before they get started?

Karel: I think it is important to know that we are very transparent and your customers are paying directly to Google and Facebook. But obviously they need to set up an account, set up a page, we come to do this for them. Because of our device, we wouldn鈥檛 be transparent and then they wouldn鈥檛 pay directly to Facebook and Google. So I think they need to just set up these and they need to be patient. It鈥檚 double advice really received so, so often that you just put it on and then you expect that some miracle happens and it鈥檚 not coming and now they鈥檙e a bit nervous. So you start changing things. No, just wait like one week. It鈥檚 the minimum really.

Jesse: So it is magic, but don鈥檛 expect miracles.

Karel: You can expect miracles, but after two weeks (laughing).

Jesse: I like it. Yeah. Okay. No, the patience is important and I think also the setup process too, like you mentioned, yeah, you鈥檙e going to have to set up some accounts. You have to log in, you have to put in your credit card with Google and Facebook. Expect that, right. There is magic. But you know, there are steps too. So there are a few things to do and be patient. I think also we have, there are a couple different promotions to get people going to. I know if maybe heard the promo at the beginning of the podcast, there are some promotions. What, what type of promotions can people get through ROI Hunter for Google and Facebook?

Karel: Well, friends from Facebook gave us some free coupons for AI advertisers. But they should hurry up because as far as I know, it鈥檚 limited till the end of February. Right? It is. Yeah.

Jesse: And for people listening to it, Facebook doesn鈥檛 always give out credits there. They鈥檙e a little tight with that, so if you think this will be extended forever and I can, I can wait. That鈥檚 not the case. It is a hard deadline at the end of February, so if you鈥檙e listening to this in February, there鈥檚 still time. If it鈥檚 later on in the year you鈥檙e hearing this, you鈥檙e probably too late on that.

Richard: Not too late to use it. Just too late to get it for free.

Jesse: For sure, for sure. You don鈥檛 need free money to do the right thing for your business, but if you want the free money, get on it right now.

Richard: Yeah, you may as well. And plus we try to reiterate this every time too. They are advertised, they make their money off advertisers, so to your point Karel, that they want, no matter how low your budget is in the beginning, they want to show you success. Because if you put in $10, I鈥檓 not going to, I鈥檒l make up a number. They want to at least give you a 12 or they want to give you some sort of number higher than the number you paid them, so you come back and give them more money and then as you described, then they should, when you get more data, increase the ad spend as long as the ROI keeps coming, keep increasing, keep watching the campaigns. I did have one question there. Even though you pay Facebook and Google directly and you have to set up those accounts, you still just manage it through ROI Hunter though, yes?

Karel: Yeah. It鈥檚 simpler for you because then you don鈥檛 have to create a feed, a Google, Facebook merchant account and all this stuff and create all these campaigns. So we do a lot of benching in the backend. We use the campaign structures that we see from these half a million campaigns. This is what we do for you, but you can always look into native Facebook and Google interface and see really what was created, how it goes. But we see that usually, it鈥檚 easier to just set up the budget and to think about it more top level because I know that small e com businesses, they have so many things to do, they don鈥檛 have time really to spend time on Facebook and Google and manage their campaigns nowadays. It needs to innovate and provide good service to their customers. Right.

Jesse: For sure. And for people who haven鈥檛 logged into your Google Ads or Facebook Ads manager, it can be a bit overwhelming. There is a lot of information there, a lot of options. So I like that. ROI Hunter has made that a lot easier. But you also have the ability to log into your accounts, native accounts if you want as well. So I think that鈥檚 a pretty, pretty cool option. Rich, any last questions for Karel before we sign off?

Richard: Oh man. I mean it鈥檚, it鈥檚 always so hard to end the podcast because once we have someone with so much knowledge in their brain, I mean I feel like I get asked eternally questions. I would just say, what do you recommend for people to just step one?

Karel: Well, step one is to start, right. They need to go to your upmarket and find Facebook and Google retargeting in the marketing section and then it鈥檚 pretty simple. They just go through steps that they will see it. Just need to create an account page and that鈥檚 it.

Jesse: I like it.

Karel: And then again, be patient.

Jesse: You鈥檝e been remarketing the patient message. I liked that. Everybody should remember: launch with ROI Hunter. It鈥檚 in the App market at 51视频, under marketing and be patient, right? Karel, if people would like to learn more about you and your companies, is there some other place that they could go?

Karel: Yeah. And they can google ROI Hunter or just type roihunter.com and they will see. We鈥檝e driven success to very large customers. And at the same time, this is the engine today can use for their small business.

Jesse: Oh, that鈥檚 perfect. Well, with the podcast here, the 51视频 E-commerce Show, we鈥檙e all about helping small businesses so Karel, I think this is awesome. I鈥檓 happy that we could share this with our listeners. Rich?

Richard: Awesome. Thanks, Karel. Have a great weekend. Get out there and get your Friday.

Jesse: Get after it.

Karel: Yeah, looking forward. Thanks a lot for having me. Bye-bye.

Richard: Bye-bye.

Jesse: Thank you.